Meta Description: Join Dr. Jeff Winkle and Dr. David Noe in Ad Navseam Episode 141 as they welcome back Dr. Ken Bratt to discuss the ancient historian Herodotus. Discover the “Gullible’s Travels” theory, the Heroic Paradox, the difference between lies and falsehoods, and how to master the Latin language
Introduction: Unseasonable Tennis and Translation Paparazzi
Welcome back, classical gourmands, to Episode 141 of the Ad Navseam Podcast! Broadcasting from the subterranean safety of Vomitorium South, your hosts, Dr. Jeff Winkle and Dr. David Noe, are back at the microphones.
Jeff arrives in the studio feeling deeply relaxed. He has successfully finished writing his final exams, hoping they will be just as entertaining for his students to complete as they were for him to compose. Dave, meanwhile, is finally seeing the light at the end of the tunnel regarding his massive translation projects. The John Arrowsmith Plans for Holy War is completely done and awaiting indexing for a spring release, and his translation of Samuel Rutherford is currently sitting at a whopping 724 pages as he works through final corrections. While Dave admits the final proofing stage is highly tedious, Jeff points out that Dave’s work is incredibly glamorous—after all, he must constantly fight off the aggressive translation paparazzi and the hordes of academic groupies waiting around every corner.
Enter Strider: Dr. Ken Bratt Returns to the Bunker
The cheerful mood is further elevated by the arrival of a very special guest. Making his third distinguished appearance on the podcast is Dr. Ken Bratt—former professor, colleague, and absolute jack-of-all-trades.
Ken previously joined the hosts to discuss the ancient catacombs and the archaeology of Philippi, but today he is here to talk about his earliest classical expertise: the ancient Greek historian Herodotus. Both Jeff and Dave have had the great privilege of traveling extensively with Ken throughout Italy and Greece. They affectionately refer to him by the nickname “Strider,” a testament to his long legs and endless walking stamina. If you plan to tour Rome with Ken Bratt, you had better eat a massive breakfast, because he will happily walk you right into the ground.
Jeff fondly recalls navigating a highly complex Italian city with Ken. Drawing upon a memory from thirty years prior, Ken guided them through a dizzying series of twists and turns, perfectly mimicking the mythological Theseus navigating the labyrinth without the benefit of a thread, leading them (mostly) flawlessly to their destination. Dave’s favorite memory involves sitting with Ken on the balcony of the Hotel Phillippos, munching on red-skinned Spanish peanuts and sipping adult beverages while watching the sun set beautifully over the Acropolis.
Why Herodotus? Surviving the Dissertation
When asked what initially drew him to Herodotus, Ken explains that he got a very late start with his ancient Greek studies, taking his first courses as a junior in college. To complete his major, he took an intensive combined course on Herodotus and Thucydides, utilizing Amy Barber’s classic textbook, Selections from Herodotus.
When it came time to choose a dissertation topic in graduate school at Princeton, Ken pragmatically avoided Homer. The sheer volume of secondary literature surrounding the epic poet was far too massive to conquer. Instead, he wisely focused on Herodotus, specifically exploring the deep Homeric influence on Herodotus’s speeches and scenes of consultation.
Ken admits the dissertation process was grueling. He started the project in his third year of graduate school, but after securing his first teaching job at Colby College, the massive demands of grading and preparation forced him to shove the Herodotus research into a drawer for several years. Complicating matters further, his original advisor, Bob Connor, suffered a detached retina and had to step away, transferring Ken to a Roman historian named Jim Luce. Despite the setbacks, Ken eventually triumphed, keeping a small cartoon on his desk that read: Veni, Vidi, Calcitravi Postremum Herodoti (I came, I saw, I kicked Herodotus’s…)
Herodotus vs. Thucydides: History, Lies, and Gullible’s Travels
The conversation eventually shifts to an engaging academic article by J.A.S. Evans titled “Herodotus: Father of History or Father of Lies”.
Ken points out a fundamental difference between Herodotus and his successor, Thucydides. In his famous proemium, Herodotus states his purpose is to preserve the remembrance of great deeds—both of the Greeks and the barbarians—preventing them from losing their due glory (an echo of the Homeric concept of kleos). Thucydides, conversely, wrote a highly focused, dense military history designed to be a permanent, useful manual for future politicians. Thucydides arrogantly dismissed entertaining narratives, resulting in a text that is notoriously difficult and dry to read. Herodotus, however, is a masterful, entertaining storyteller; reading him is like bumping into an incredibly well-traveled man at a pub who bends your ear with exotic tales of how Egyptians mummify crocodiles.
Evans’s article highlights a quote from Cicero, who stated that accuracy is the strict business of the historian, yet he still crowned Herodotus the “Father of History” despite his countless legends. Some ancient critics, like Plutarch, viciously attacked Herodotus for intentional “malignity” and falsehoods.
Ken offers a highly perceptive defense: we must distinguish between lies and falsehoods. A lie is an intentional misrepresentation of the truth, while a falsehood is simply incorrect information relayed without deceptive intent. Herodotus traveled extensively through Egypt and Babylon, entirely dependent on local tour guides and translators. He frequently recorded these localized accounts precisely because he believed how people remembered their past was a vital historical fact in its own right, even if he personally disagreed with the narrative. As Dave summarizes, Herodotus wasn’t a malicious liar; he was simply a victim of “Gullible’s Travels”.
The Heroic Paradox and Traveling with the Father of History
Ken passionately argues that Herodotus remains essential reading because he provides the greatest available window into the archaic, pan-Hellenic mind. Unlike many Greek authors who displayed a deep cultural arrogance, Herodotus possessed a profound, cosmopolitan humanity, demonstrating immense respect for the contributions of non-Greek societies.
Furthermore, Herodotus masterfully captures what Cedric Whitman called the “heroic paradox”. In the ancient worldview, ultimate greatness and inevitable disaster arise from the exact same root, because moderation is entirely impossible for those striving for heroic heights. Ken’s favorite example is the Persian King Xerxes, who proudly builds a massive bridge across the Hellespont to review his towering, unconquerable army, only to suddenly burst into tears upon realizing that in one hundred years, every single man before him will be dead.
This deep humanity makes Herodotus the ultimate travel companion for anyone visiting Greece. Reading his accounts brings the physical landscape to life. Whether you are standing on the Colonus at Thermopylae reading the modern reconstruction of Simonides’ epigram, viewing the statues of Cleobis and Biton in the Delphi museum, gazing out at the waters of Salamis where Xerxes placed his golden throne, or climbing the great tumulus mound at Marathon where the Persians were driven into the marshes, Herodotus makes the ancient world pulse with vivid, unforgettable energy.
Sponsors: Fueling the Classical Renaissance
Before “Lazy Steve” causes any more distracting construction noise upstairs, the hosts take a moment to celebrate Mishka the sound engineer’s recent birthday and thank the generous sponsors who keep the vomitorium humming.
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- MossMethod & Latin Per Diem: Do you want to read Herodotus in his original Ionic dialect? Dave’s MossMethod will take your ancient Greek from “neophyte to erudite”. Alternatively, you can master the Latin language from the ground up using Hans Ørberg’s Lingua Latina Per Se Illustrata. Visit latinperdiem.com to join students from all over the world in these interactive, highly affordable courses.
The Gustatory Parting Shot
To close out Episode 141, Jeff reaches deep into the annals of punk rock history to deliver an exceptionally goofy Gustatory Parting Shot.
Referencing the spectacularly bad movie Rock ‘n’ Roll High School starring the seminal punk band the Ramones, Jeff explains that bassist Dee Dee Ramone was such an atrocious actor that the director had to cut almost all of his dialogue. They left him with just one line, which he still managed to deliver with incredible awkwardness:
“Hey, pizza. It’s great. Let’s dig in.”
Whether you are enjoying a slice of pizza or touring the ruins of Halicarnassus, keep taking in the classics. Valete!
