Meta Description: Join Dr. Jeff Winkle and Dr. David Noe in Ad Navseam Episode 198 as they conclude their series on Carl Richard’s The Golden Age of the Classics in America. Explore the use of classical texts in the antebellum slavery debate, the decline of the classics, and resources to master the Latin language.
Introduction: Autumn Weather and Middle Initials
Welcome back, classical gourmands, to Episode 198 of the Ad Navseam Podcast! Broadcasting from the subterranean depths of Vomitorium Centra, your hosts, Dr. David Noe and Dr. Jeff Winkle, return to the microphones to discuss the intersection of classical antiquity and American history.
The boys open the episode by embracing the crisp, autumnal turn in the Michigan weather. Dave warns Jeff to be on the lookout for the “abdominal snowman,” a mythical winter creature known for grabbing people and forcing them to do crunches. Proceeding to the traditional middle initial joke, Jeff claims his “T” stands for “Twainy,” as he is feeling a bit like the author Mark Twain. Dave’s “C” stands for the Columbian Orator, an early nineteenth-century textbook containing speeches by Edward Everett, Demosthenes, and Cicero. The young Frederick Douglass used this exact volume to teach himself how to read.
Listener Mail: Corrigenda from Local Will
Before moving forward, the hosts issue a call to action for their upcoming bicentennial episode. They invite listeners to record short audio clips detailing their experiences with the podcast or the classics and email them to the show.
The mailbag features a detailed corrigendum from a frequent contributor, Local Will Fitzgerald. Will offers corrections and clarifications on past podcast topics, starting with the MacArthur Fellowships. He notes that the “genius grant” has awarded 173 fellowships in the humanities, alongside 355 in STEM and 338 in the arts.
Next, Will corrects a quote attributed to Mark Twain regarding golf.
While Dave previously quoted it as “a good walk ruined,” Will points out that the earliest attribution to Twain appeared in 1948, thirty years after the author’s death. Will also provides the original German text for a Friedrich Nietzsche quote about walking and thinking, and corrects a country music reference, noting that Johnny Lee was the original artist to record the song “Lookin’ for Love,” not Conway Twitty. Dave replies that he still prefers Conway Twitty’s version regardless of the historical record.
Slavery and the Classical Republics
The core academic focus of Episode 198 is the final chapter and epilogue of Carl Richard’s book, The Golden Age of the Classics in America. Chapter 7 delves into the complex, contradictory ways classical antiquity was utilized during the antebellum debates over American slavery.
Dave and Jeff explain that the founding generation of America viewed the democratic experiment of ancient Athens with suspicion, preferring the structure of a republic. Many of these early founders, including George Washington and Thomas Jefferson, viewed slavery as a necessary evil. However, as the Industrial Revolution and the invention of the cotton gin turned cotton into a massive cash crop, Southern defenders of slavery shifted their perspective. They began to point to Athens as an ideal model because its political equality and cultural achievements rested on a foundation of slave labor.
Southern politicians like Senator Robert Toombs and Thomas Dew argued that domestic slavery and public liberty were cradled together. They praised the Spartan helot system for freeing citizens from manual labor, though they preferred the Athenian free-market economy over Sparta’s strict state indoctrination.
Writers like George Fitzhugh engaged in rigorous cherry-picking of the historical record. Fitzhugh argued that slavery elevated poor whites to the status of privileged citizens, comparing Southern white citizens to the master classes of ancient Greece and Rome. Dave expresses his distaste for these self-serving arguments, noting that ancient slavery was typically based on the conquest of prisoners of war rather than the modern concept of race.
Aristotle as the Southern Spokesman
According to Richard, Aristotle served as the favorite classical spokesman for Southern slavery advocates.
In his Politics, Aristotle argued that some men were naturally born to lead, while others possessed physical power suited only for a state of slavery. Politicians like John C. Calhoun relied on Aristotle’s treatises to legitimize their claims. Fitzhugh even admitted that he had been plagiarizing Aristotle’s theories for years without realizing it. The hosts observe that citing Aristotle functioned as a powerful appeal to authority, granting the Southern position two thousand years of presumed intellectual validation. Furthermore, these advocates rejected the Enlightenment theories of Thomas Hobbes and John Locke, who posited a state of nature where all individuals enjoyed inherent freedom and equality. Instead, Southern advocates leaned on classical paternalism, framing the master-slave dynamic as an extension of natural familial governance.
The Abolitionist Counterargument
Abolitionists responded by using the classics to dismantle the Southern defense. They argued that slavery was the greatest inherent flaw of Athens and the other ancient republics.
Frederick Douglass utilized his knowledge of classical oratory to declare that communities are saved by honesty, not by artistic beauty or architectural splendor. In 1829, the abolitionist David Walker drew a sharp distinction between Roman slavery and the American brand. Walker pointed out that an enslaved person in ancient Rome could obtain freedom, amass wealth, and rise to political eminence, whereas American laws prohibited people of color from holding government offices. Walker also invoked the Carthaginian general Hannibal to inspire resistance against the “new Rome”.
The abolitionists championed the classical theory of natural law, though they interpreted it through the modern lens of natural rights to life, liberty, and property. Charles Sumner cited the Roman statesman Cicero to argue that unjust, pestilent statutes do not constitute legitimate law, echoing the sentiment that an unjust law is null.
The Epilogue: A Turning Point
Wrapping up their discussion of the book, Dave and Jeff turn to Richard’s epilogue. Richard concludes that the American Civil War served as the ultimate turning point for the classics in America.
Before the war, classical literature dominated the American educational curriculum. Following the conflict, the United States industrialized. Figures like Henry Adams complained that a strict classical education left young men unprepared for the modern, mechanized twentieth century. Consequently, the classics began a steep decline, transitioning from mandatory entrance requirements to specialized university majors. Richard ends his work with a gastronomical metaphor, noting that the classics provided a giant smorgasbord from which various individuals concocted the precise feasts that suited their ideological tastes.
Sponsors: Fueling the Classical Renaissance
Before the abdominal snowman bursts into the studio to enforce a mandatory core workout, the hosts thank the sponsors who keep the podcast running.
- Ratio Coffee: Do not ruin your mornings with a cheap, plastic coffee maker. The Ratio 8 and Ratio 6 machines offer a flawless brewing experience with a single button press. The Fibonacci showerhead handles the essential bloom phase, off-gassing the trapped carbon dioxide to extract the perfect flavor. Visit ratiocoffee.com/adnavseam and use the code ANRATIO2025 to receive a $20 discount on your order.
- Della Chelpka Art: Decorate your home with custom oil paintings that speak to your personal story. Tucson-based artist Della Chelpka captures people and places with exact detail. Visit dellachelpka.art and use the code Apelles (named for the famous ancient painter) for a 10% discount.
- Hackett Publishing: For over five decades, Hackett has published accessible, attractive academic texts. Check out their two-volume set of Aristotle’s works, complete with a handsome slipcase. Go to hackettpublishing.com and use the code AN2025 for a 20% discount and free shipping.
- MossMethod & LatinPerDiem: Take your ancient Greek from neophyte to erudite with Dave’s comprehensive courses. If you want to master the Latin language, visit latinperdiem.com for thorough, self-paced video lessons. Use the code 10PLUS for a 10% discount on your order.
The Gustatory Parting Shot
To close out Episode 198, Dave reads a unique Gustatory Parting Shot from Aimee Bender’s short story collection, The Color Master.
“When she left the store, emboldened, receipt tucked into her purse, folded twice, Janet thought of all the chicken dishes she had not sent back, even though they were either half raw or not what she had ordered. Chicken Kiev instead of chicken marsala, chicken with mushrooms instead of chicken a la king, her body was made up of the wrong chickens.”
A special thanks to Mishka the sound engineer and Jeff Scheetz for the guitar riffs. Watch out for the abdominal snowman, send in those audio clips, and keep taking in the classics. Valete!
