Ad Navseam Episode 25
Meta Description: Join Dr. David Noe and Dr. Jeff Winkle for a special “Silver Anniversary” episode featuring New York Times bestselling author Gary D. Schmidt. Discover why he prefers the Odyssey to the Iliad, how Charles Dickens shapes his writing, and the discipline of writing exactly 500 words a day.
Introduction: The First Live Guest in the Vomitorium
Welcome back to the “vomitorium,” listeners! Episode 25 marks a milestone for the Ad Navseam Podcast—our “Silver Anniversary” episode. While the hosts celebrate inside, the Michigan weather outside is anything but festive. It is officially “hatchet weather,” a season so cold that homeowners (including our guest) are forced to take hatchets to their roofs to break up ice dams.
Despite the chill, the studio is warm with conversation as hosts Dr. David Noe and Dr. Jeff Winkle welcome their first-ever live guest: the acclaimed author and Calvin University colleague, Gary D. Schmidt.
Known for his poignant and humorous middle-grade novels like The Wednesday Wars, Okay for Now, and Lizzie Bright and the Buckminster Boy, Gary joins the show to discuss the intersection of the Latin language, classical literature, and the disciplined life of a writer.
Iliad vs. Odyssey: A Formative Choice
The conversation begins with Gary’s own “classical education”—a self-imposed summer reading list from his youth that included the Iliad, the Odyssey, Dante’s Divine Comedy, and The Lord of the Rings.
His verdict on Homer’s epics is controversial but relatable. He recalls struggling through the Iliad, largely because he couldn’t stand the protagonist. “I thought I should like Achilles,” Gary admits, “but I didn’t. He’s sort of a jerk.”
The Odyssey, however, was a revelation. Gary was captivated by the structure of the journey—the nostos (homecoming). This motif of a long, arduous return became a blueprint for his own storytelling. While he doesn’t write epic fantasy, he argues that his realistic novels feature “epic interior journeys” where characters must navigate their own monsters to find a place of belonging.
The Craft of Writing: 500 Words and Charles Dickens
Gary offers a fascinating glimpse into his writing process, revealing a discipline that is as rigid as it is effective. He writes exactly 500 words a day.
“I don’t care how the horses are running,” he says. “I’m done.” He cites Jack London, Hemingway, and Steinbeck as proponents of this method, arguing that consistency matters more than bursts of inspiration.
The Dickensian Influence
When asked about his literary influences, Gary points immediately to Charles Dickens. He admires Dickens not for his length, but for his radical empathy and refusal to provide easy answers.
- No Hallmark Endings: Gary notes that Dickens canceled the original “happy” illustration for the end of Oliver Twist because it felt false. Similarly, Gary refuses to wrap his stories in a neat bow. “Life isn’t a Hallmark card,” he asserts.
- Empathy for the Downtrodden: He references a scene in Bleak House where a street child dies, and Dickens breaks the narrative frame to address Queen Victoria directly: “Dead, your Majesty.” This willingness to confront society’s failures is a trait Gary strives to emulate in his own books.
The Liminality of Middle School
A recurring theme in the discussion is the unique nature of the middle school audience. Dr. Winkle introduces the term Liminality (from the Latin limen, meaning “threshold”).
Gary agrees that middle school is the ultimate liminal space. Kids in this phase are “betwixt and between,” swaying wildly between childhood and adulthood. “At one moment they are 10 years old… and a few minutes later they act like they are 25,” he observes.
This instability creates the tension necessary for great storytelling. In our culture, which lacks formal rites of passage, Gary’s characters must often create their own moments of transition—choosing their own beliefs and vocations rather than inheriting them.
Teaching the Classics: From Lear to Genesis
As a professor, Gary also reflects on the texts he loves (and hates) to teach.
- King Lear: He admits he is “sort of done” with Shakespeare’s tragedy because it is so “unrelieved” in its downward spiral. The lack of hope makes it a grueling experience for the classroom.
- Genesis: Conversely, he has found new joy in teaching the book of Genesis, specifically using Robert Alter’s translation. He praises Alter for revealing the literary artistry of the biblical text, stripping away the “King James” familiarity to show the raw, complex narrative underneath.
Latin Language SEO Spotlight
For our students of the Latin language and classical civilization, this episode highlights several key concepts:
- Limen (Threshold): The state of transition. Essential for analyzing coming-of-age literature (Bildungsroman).
- Gravitas (Weight/Seriousness): Despite writing for children, Gary treats his subjects with immense gravitas, refusing to talk down to his audience or shield them from the difficult realities of the world.
- Labor (Struggle): Writing is depicted not as a magical act, but as a labor—a daily, disciplined effort of 500 words, echoing the Roman virtue of industria.
Sponsors
This episode of Ad Navseam is brought to you by friends of the classics:
- Ratio Coffee: For a brew that utilizes “bloom” technology to off-gas CO2, ensuring a cup with no “brackish tang.” The new Ratio 4 is on the horizon!.
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- Ad Astra Roasters: “To the Stars through Coffee!” (Ad Astra Per Caffea).
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Gustatory Parting Shot
Dr. Winkle wraps up this landmark episode with a quote from Ralph Waldo Emerson, a reminder to seize the moment (or Carpe Diem, if you will):
“There are only 10 minutes in the life of a pear when it is perfect to eat.”Valete! (And stay warm in the hatchet weather).
