Meta Description: Join Dr. Jeff Winkle and Dr. David Noe in Ad Navseam Episode 68 for a groundbreaking “Married with Classicists” special. The hosts are joined by their wives, Bec Winkle and Tara Noe, to discuss the perils of travel with academics, the “Jippy Tummy,” and the truth about living with men who correct your grammar at the dinner table. Plus, a look at the Latin language of marriage and the “Cheese Banks” of Parma.
Introduction: The Vomitorium Breached
Welcome back to the “Vomitorium,” listeners! It is Episode 68 of the Ad Navseam Podcast, and history is being made. For the first time ever, the sanctuary of classical commentary has been infiltrated by civilians. Your hosts, Dr. David Noe and Dr. Jeff Winkle, are usually the only voices echoing off these walls, but today they are joined by two very special guests: their wives, Tara Noe and Bec Winkle.
This is the long-promised “Married with Classicists” episode. The listeners might have thought the hosts were being dishonest—promising so many things and delivering so little—but today, they are “manning up” and following through. It is time to pull back the curtain and see what it’s really like to live with men who obsess over Cicero, Homer, and the Latin language.
Shout-Out: The Cheese Banks of Parma
Before the marital airing of grievances begins, we have a shout-out that could be an episode in itself. This comes from Paul Jabore, an Australian by birth, British by adoption, and a man who understands the “hard yakka” of learning Latin later in life. Paul shares a fascinating detail about his time living in Parma, Italy. He notes that instead of money, many locals have wheels of cheese in the bank. These giant wheels of Parmesan age for years and are worth thousands of Euros. Dr. Winkle loves this image: “The cheese on the bus goes round and round.” To Paul, for his “ambition stoked by revulsion” regarding public service work: Macte virtute!
The Latin of Love: Consensus vs. Cohabitation
To set the mood, the wives read some opening quotes about marriage.
Bec Winkle reads a lovely quote from Martin Luther: “There is no more lovely, friendly, and charming relationship… than a good marriage.”
Tara Noe, however, gets the Cicero quote:
“Not cohabitation, but consensus constitutes marriage.”
Dr. Noe notes that this isn’t exactly material for a Valentine’s card. It reflects the Roman view: marriage was often a political arrangement or a legal contract (consensus), not necessarily a romance. Cicero himself had a miserable marriage to Terentia, largely because he leveraged the family into debt to buy villas. He wasn’t exactly “husband of the year” material.
The Annoyance Factor: Old Material and Precision
The hosts bravely ask their wives: “What is the one thing we do that annoys you?” For Bec, it is the “recycling of material.” Dr. Winkle has a tendency to tell the same stories and jokes repeatedly. Beck even has a specific finger she holds up to indicate, “I have heard this twice already.” It is the burden of the oral tradition—the bard must repeat his songs!
For Tara, it is something uniquely philological: Precision.
Dr. Noe cannot turn off the “Classicist brain.” He corrects grammar and insists on precise word usage during casual family dinner conversations.
“The kind of precision that makes one a good philologist… doesn’t make for good family conversations.” Tara confirms this is true. Living with a man who analyzes your syntax while passing the potatoes is a unique cross to bear.
The Wives’ Backgrounds: Story vs. Science
The conversation reveals that neither wife came from a Classics background. Bec Winkle is an English teacher who loves narrative. She didn’t have a strong history education growing up (her teacher was the tennis coach who let them have study hall), but she connected with the Classics through Jeff’s ability to tell the story. She loves the “liminal spaces” and the humanity of history.
Tara Noe comes from a math and science background. She prefers the “right or wrong” answers of biology to the subjective interpretations of literature. However, she did take a Medical Terminology course in graduate school at the University of Iowa. The plot twist? Dr. Noe was the instructor. He admits to winking at her before handing out the exam. (Don’t worry, she got a 98.8% on her own merit). It was a romance forged over Greek and Latin roots.
Travel Diaries: Strollers on Cobblestones
The group reminisces about their travels to Italy and Greece. The “Jippy Tummy”: Tara recalls the first trip to Italy in 2004 with two small children. They quickly learned that umbrella strollers do not work on Roman cobblestones. It was a bone-shaking experience for the toddlers. They also dealt with the “Jippy Tummy”—a polite term for getting violently ill while traveling. Dr. Noe recalls staring off into the distance to take a photo while a child was “launching” their lunch all over Tara. It’s the glamour of travel they don’t put in the brochures.
Climbing Tall Things and Looking at Dead Guys: Bec summarizes her first trip to Italy with a perfect subtitle: “Climbing Tall Things and Looking at Dead Guys.” That is essentially the itinerary of a Classicist. You climb the dome in Florence, you climb the tower in Siena, and you look at tombs. However, she admits that the Scavi Tour (underneath St. Peter’s Basilica to see the bones of St. Peter) was a highlight because the guide turned it into a compelling story.
The Shepherds of Students
Both couples have led student trips, which Dr. Winkle describes as a “Herculean effort.” Tara recalls the stress of counting off students to ensure no one was lost. They did lose one student in Pompeii (briefly) who had wandered off to the restroom in 95-degree heat. Dr. Winkle praises Tara’s detective skills. She once busted a student who was smuggling six liters of Mountain Dew in his backpack into the Borghese Gallery and sneaking out to buy snacks. You cannot hide from the faculty wife.
The Curse of the Absent Husband
When the husbands travel alone with students, things often go wrong at home. Bec Winkle has identified a pattern of three disasters that always strike when Jeff leaves:
- Violent Illness: Everyone gets the flu.
- Major Weather Event: A polar vortex or ice storm hits Michigan.
- House Failure: The roof leaks or pipes freeze. The most infamous incident involved the toilet overflowing and raining water into the kitchen while Jeff was FaceTiming her from a beautiful balcony in Delphi. Talk about a contrast in fortunes.
The Muskrat in the Window: Tara has her own horror story. While Dave was away, a muskrat fell into their uncovered window well. Dr. Noe’s helpful advice from across the ocean? “Put a board down there.” The muskrat did not use the board. The story has a “somewhat violent ending” involving services held upon Dr. Noe’s return. It is a cautionary tale about home maintenance.
The Game: Classicist or Not?
Bec reveals a game she and Jeff play at conferences: “Classicist or Not a Classicist?”
It is basically “fish in a barrel.” The telltale signs?
- Looking a little lost.
- Slightly disheveled.
- Dark clothing (especially for the women).
- Glasses. Bec is currently undefeated. If you are wandering around a hotel lobby looking confused and wearing black, you have likely been spotted.
Gifts: The Olive Wood Tsunami
What do the husbands bring back to apologize for leaving? Olive Wood. So much olive wood. Tara and Bec confirm they have an abundance of olive wood bowls, tongs, and forks. Dr. Noe once even brought back an olive wood butter knife. Dr. Winkle recalls a failed attempt to find a yarn shop in Rome for Bec. He spent the last day running around the city, going 0-for-3 on shops that were either closed or non-existent. He likely returned with more olive oil soap to compensate.
Sponsors: Gifts for the Patient Spouse
This episode is brought to you by:
- Ratio Coffee: For the spouse who needs caffeine to deal with the polar vortex while you are in Greece.
- The Deal: Visit ratiocoffee.com and use code ANCO for 15% off.
- The Giveaway: Enter the secret code 6567 at ratiocoffee.com/anco to win a free Ratio 6!
- Hackett Publishing: For the books you read on the plane while leaving your family behind.
- The Deal: Visit hackettpublishing.com and use code AN2021 (soon to be AN2022!) for 20% off.
- The Moss Method: Want to learn the roots of the medical terms your wife studies? Dr. Noe’s course takes you from “Neophyte to Erudite.”
- The Deal: Visit latinperdiem.com.
The Gustatory Parting Shot
We wrap up this special episode with two quotes, one for each wife.
For Bec: From Justin Swapp:
“You never cook onions with your beans. That is a recipe for tear gas.”
For Tara: From Margaret Atwood:
“Nothing helps gluttony along so well as eating food you don’t have to pay for yourself.”
A fitting end for the “junket” lifestyle of the traveling academic.
Valete! (And watch out for muskrats).
Resources for the Latin Learner:
- The Moss Method: Inspired by Tara’s medical terminology journey? Learn the Latin language roots and more at latinperdiem.com.
